Understanding Your Unique Personality Using the 9 Enneagram Types & How It Can Impact Your Business & Relationships

Understanding Your Unique Personality Using the 9 Enneagram Types & How It Can Impact Your Business & Relationships

Kristin Throckmorton is an Enneagram coach who has a deep desire for people to know themselves better so their unique good can shine into the world. As a (former) teacher, wife, and mom of two young kiddos, Kristin has experienced first hand what it is like to loose yourself in the chaos of family and work life and desires to see everyone flourish, not just get through, in all seasons of life. For Kristin and her husband, that meant learning and applying Enneagram wisdom personally and in their relationship, which was a GAME CHANGER. When Kristin isn't meeting with groups, couples, and individuals, you can find her running around a lake, at the park after school, or with a book and a really good cup of coffee.




Jenna Redfield is the leader of the Twin Cities Collective, the largest resource in the Twin Cities for bloggers, small business, entrepreneurs & creatives.

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Hey, everyone, welcome to Twin Cities collective podcast. I'm your host Jenna Redfield, and today we have a special guest

Kristin, welcome. Hello.

Thank you this your first podcast?

Yeah, awesome. Well, I'm so excited. You've never met before. But I saw her Instagram and I thought, Oh my gosh, I have to have her on because she's all about Instagram. So can you explain to us like a little bit about what your businesses and how you got started with the Instagram?

Kristin Throckmorton 1:25

Yeah, so I'm Kristin Brock, Martin and I, my business is called her Tov, and it is a gram coaching and consulting company that works with I work with individuals, I work with couples, I work with teams in in companies and businesses and universities and wherever, and we use the underground primarily as our way to get down into who we truly are as people because when we are able to do that, then we can make some really big strides in, in our life really, and our teams and how we interact with people. So Tov to V is an it's an ancient, and you get an engine, and you're going oh my goodness, in Hebrew word, that means good. But it's this good. It's not like, Oh, it's so good. It's like this good, that gives good, that gives good. And so if you think of like a plant that has these seeds, and the seeds are really specific to the plant, and really unique to the plant. And so the seed when it is growing, is going to create are going to grow the plant that it came from. And so the idea that we are all unique people, we all have these unique seeds of good in us. And the idea is that we need to bring them out. And so using the anagram to do that is just one tool. But it's the best tool I found. And so that's what I that's what we do is we work to bring good out in people. Because we need more good in the world.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 2:54

That's so true. So how did you get started with this business and the unigram? A few

Kristin Throckmorton 2:58

years ago, probably like four or five, I met with a friend who was also a coach at that point. And we she just took me through what enneagram is. And it was, honestly the most life changing tool I have ever found. And ever since I learned I'm a nine. But ever since I learned my number, it has given me language toward things that I behaviors that I have that I just, you know, sometimes we ask ourselves, like, why do I do the things I do, I just I can't get a hold on it or like I you know, when we're stressed we we are a certain way. And when we're feeling really good and healthy, where we kind of act in a different way sometimes. And so the gram gave me language to all of those things. And I don't just use it personally anymore. Obviously, I also use it in my coaching, but personally and in my relationships in my marriage, it has absolutely changed the way that I interact with people.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 3:59

So the for those who don't know, and I'm still like a newbie to the new Graham, I know kind of what it is. It is a personality test that has nine numbers, correct? Yep. And so it's kind of like it's kind of like Myers Briggs, or one of those where you get an answer at the end. And that is your, like, personality type. Like there's 16 for Myers Briggs, I think 16 personalities, I think, because it's like, I'm taking it a few times, I think I'm an NF j or the last one I took it changes. So I don't know. So can you explain like, first of all, what, how do how does the test work? And then maybe like some about like, what are the what are the results? Okay, I'm going to just back up.

Kristin Throckmorton 4:39

Yeah. And I'll just, I'll give a little bit about what the anagram like, because what it actually is, so, yep, it's a circle. It has nine, nine numbers around the circle, nine at the top going around from one from there. And there are lines and arrows that connect these these numbers in some specific ways. The idea is that there is there's movement in the program. And so yeah, you're gonna you're going to land on a number if you take a test and online test, which not all tests are created equal. And not all tests are going to be correct. Yeah, and I mean, because really, if you take it and you're like in a in a funk, or a, you're in a mood, or you're feeling, you know, today is not your day, it's probably going to spit out some different answers, some different numbers, then, if you're feeling really good, and you're feeling happy, and about life, so. So you've got these nine numbers in the circle, they're connected with lines and arrows, and there's movement. So I am a nine and I hit I land there most heavily. But each of us have a little bit of every number in us. Because we're we're human. And we're like really intricate beings. And so. But we we tend into one number, because it's the way that we kind of interact with the world. And so so, yeah, it's just it's just this really intricate, intricate thing. Do you know the history behind it? at all? Yeah, a little bit. So it's super old? Oh, yeah. in it. It used to be only it used to be only a an oral tradition, or an oral way of being and some people will say like the desert fathers and mothers used it way back when not, and it's not in how we see it today. But the idea that there's nine different personalities in the world, and like you said, that undergirds all of humanity, really. And so what happened was that there have been people along the way that have started to think and ask questions and talk about what these nine ways of being in the world are. And they kind of came to this symbol and this this way. So came from Chile and into the United States that in the I think it was the 70s it was really recently and you know, on the scope of the world. But it wasn't meant to be written down. It was just meant to be used in in like the US like spiritual directors and those coaches and therapists and those sorts of people who are helping others. I was never meant to be a book. It was never meant to be any of this. And so. But father Richard Rohr is a really big component of enneagram. But it, it has been so helpful that people started to write books about it. And so now here we are today, why has it blown up? I don't know. My, my hunch is that in an age where social media is just so huge, and you know, you're kind of putting out what you are and who you are. And face to face is like kind of a thing of the past, not really of the past, but it's just so you don't do it as much anymore. And people really want to be seen, and they really want to be heard. And they really want to be seen for who they are. And, and so I think that you know, you see posts where somebody is like, hey, yeah, I'm a, I'm a for Hey, let me know what you are. And everyone's like, yeah, for over here. I'm a nine. I'm a two. Oh, yeah. And that's really great. And there's more to that true. So and whatever number you are, you've got these. You've got these really great parts of you. And then you have these kind of shadowy side. So yeah, so it's a little bit different than like a Myers Briggs. Because Myers Briggs is gonna spit out four letters, right? And it's like, you're either an iron e or you're there, whatever. And it doesn't give you a lot of space to move. And it doesn't even show you kind of your shadow sides where you work. Yeah, your weaknesses. And I don't even know if I'd call it weakness, but more like, these are the things that I do when I'm not feeling my true in. I'm not like limiting to myself. I'm more of my personality. Okay, so now I'm going to notice these things. I'm going to work out of it. Myers Briggs doesn't really do that.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 9:18

Yeah, it's a little bit more surfacing. I guess. I feel like the new ground goes a little bit deeper.

Kristin Throckmorton 9:24

Yep, it totally Yep. And it doesn't box you into anything. I think Myers Briggs, you it's like, you're an artist in or you're a guardian and those like all that you can be. And I took Myers Briggs long ago, I came out I don't even remember who I

am. But I just remember thinking, gosh, is that it? Is that all? I just, I just got boxed into something. And I don't think I like it.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 9:50

Yeah. So let's talk about what the nine things are. So do kind of want to touch through and you said you're nine. So do you want start at nine? Or do you wanna start one?

Kristin Throckmorton 10:00

I will.

I'll start at one. Okay. Yeah. Because Yeah. Okay, so. So before we go into these nine things, I think one other important bit to get to is that I, if you're, if you're looking to type yourself, like I said, like a test is only going to get you so far. It's just it's important to this is like a conversation. thing, like tests are great. And there's more, right? So I'll give you will go through them. And if they, if you can't, if you're listening, and you're like, I just I mean, I fit in like four of these. It's probably a little bit true. And there's, you know, you have a, I forgot to mention, you've got your, your, the number that you that you sit at most heavily, but then the lines in the arrows help you to get to other numbers when you're stressed. And when you're feeling relaxed. So yeah, yeah, that's why that's why there's lines and arrows. And that's why I knew Graham is a circle. And that's why I say there's movement because you can, if, if I'm feeling stressed, I know that I moved down to six, and I've got these things that I do, can I pull up? Can I find I noticed that I'm doing and then pull myself out of it. When I'm feeling really good. And relax, I know I go to three and I have I can kind of pull out the the positive qualities or the negative qualities of three. And so I'm

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 11:29

good to know all that all them are so yeah, let's go through them. So we know what each of them is. Yeah.

Kristin Throckmorton 11:34

Alright, so type one is the good person. And they are super hard working. And they're really reliable, they've got really high standards, they want to make the world a really good place. And, and sometimes that can slip into perfection. So whenever with each of these numbers, it's like you've got the really great part of you. And then if, if we just kind of go a little bit too far, we kind of turn a little bit and then it becomes the shadow. Yeah, the the shadow side or like the, the part of the work that we need to do side, right. So. So for one, when we twist a little bit, we can move into perfectionism. And and, and that just, that's just that's just the thing we've got like this, this inner critic that ones have this inner critic that is just so loud in their head saying you should do this, you should do this, why aren't you doing this ones will always be much harder on themselves than they'll ever than we could ever be on that, right. So at their best, they can see potential and everything. And they really like to have fun. And when they're at their worst, or the shadow side, they can feel constantly criticized. And so the the idea of one is open handedness and not trying to control everything, but getting into like the serenity kind of space to because the loving person and they are like your natural nurture the hair really, they're really warm. They're good listener, they really like to help they like to connect people.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 13:11

Like I took the test and I came out to six and nine, so I'm just listening.

Kristin Throckmorton 13:17

Yeah, so they want to make the world a more loving, loving place. And, and at their best they, they can acknowledge their needs, and they can practice really good self care at their worst, which is, again, their shadow side, when all of these things that are really great kind of turn a little bit. They can sometimes create needs and others that need to be fixed by them. So a little bit prideful. And, and they might not like to be alone, because when they're alone, then whatever they they can be whatever they need to be for another person. But when they're alone, it's really hard to know who they actually are now that's true. And so self care getting it's really important than getting alone, which is like the hardest. Right? But super important. It is it is really important. Yeah. So So for today's we're looking at humility as like the we call it number two the thing when you're healthiest, like okay, yeah, I I know you need help. I know, I'm not the one to help you. But I'm just gonna let that be. Okay, stat. Interesting. Yeah. Type three is the effective person. And so they are, they're super hard working, they're really confident they can be super energetic and really organized. And they want to make the world more efficient and effective. It's a little bit different from ones because ones have this. It's like you go from A, B, C, D, you have a list and you follow the list. And they're very, they're rule followers. threes are like, Hey, I see this needs to be done. I'm just going to go do it. And I'm going to skip over steps along the way. Okay, so ones and threes can kind of clash. Because one, they're like, Hey, you didn't follow the rules, enthusiastic? Yeah, but I got it done. Interesting. Yeah. So I'm at their worst, or their shadow sides, they can kind of they can forget their hearts and their emotions and things. And they can, you can kind of push those emotions and the feelings out in for the sake of productivity in themselves, and then others too. So that's like the thing that we got to be a little bit careful of, if we're three. And they can also become really competitive and super image conscious, chameleon legs, they can, they can kind of work a room to get one foot farther into the door sort of situation. And they really like to show off their accomplishments. And this is again on the shadow side. So the virtue or the thing we're working towards them in threes is authenticity.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 15:49

Interesting. I feel like I can like picture people like, right now when I'm listening. I'm like my Filipino people like that.

Kristin Throckmorton 15:55

Yes. Which a caution toward we don't want to type others. hard not to do. And I mean, like for it right? Like inside it's actually helpful if you if you understand the enneagram and to to be like, okay, they're kind of like three ish right now. Are there you know, I can see that. Okay, so that's gonna, that's gonna change how I have a little bit. Okay, and that's okay. We don't want to like be at a party and be like, and I think that this person's a to I think this one's because kind of you're showing a lot of their their car. Yeah, there for sure. Yeah, it makes sense. And you don't want to box them in Yeah.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 16:30

Been boxing, boxing. Right. And it's hard to do. Everyone

Kristin Throckmorton 16:33

does it. But that's just like my caveat. Yeah. Okay, so type four is the original person. And they are super creative. They're deeply sensitive. They're very poetic, and they really value authenticity. So fours have this ability is amazing ability to hold the both and, and emotionally, they love they're like, an emotional roller coaster. So they love the dreams of emotion, like the high highs and low lows. And they really like to hang out there. So if you think of like, sadness from inside out, and they're actually saying, this is a really good example of just like, everything is kind of sad. But joy and sadness need to work together. So it's like the, the extremes there. Yeah. They need to learn how to work together in order to become more integrated. Yeah, way. And sadness. also has this part where she is sitting with the imaginary friend, which I don't remember his name, but Bing Bing Bong.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 17:31

Yeah. I saw a movie once a long time ago. Yeah, like, like the elephant. Great movie.

Kristin Throckmorton 17:36

Right? Good. But But fours are really good at sitting with people in their emotions, a lot of a lot of numbers will just run away like oh, shoot your you're like emoting. And it's really hard right now. And a four is like, Hey, I am cool to sit here with you for as long as you need to. And I don't need to say anything, or I can or whatnot. But But I can do that. And so the when we turn all of that really good foreignness it can turn into it can turn into feeling like there's something missing. And so fours are on a quest for whatever is missing, it could be in a room, it could be inside. And the high highs and the lows of emotion are really great. Until they land down in the despair, which can turn into depression, or melon melancholy would be a good word. And, and, and so they can also feel abandoned or left out because they're on the search. But for his fours are just there. They're also character stereotypically artistic, and creative. But that doesn't mean that every creative or artist is a four and all fours are creatives and artists.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 18:53

I think there's a lot of foreigners in our community. I just tend to see that.

Yeah. And I feel okay, because we are

a local creative. You know, maybe there's just more of us in here. Yeah.

Kristin Throckmorton 19:03

And it could be and that's so beautiful. Yeah, that's really cool. Um, the, the virtue for for is equanimity, which just means I am going to be okay. And I'm just going to be here, it's gonna be okay. Type five is called the wise person. And so fives, and fives are near and dear to me, but they, they have this, this, this, this insatiable need to just figure things out, they want to learn and that's really yeah, they want to learn, they want to dig down deep into all kinds of all kinds of interesting things. But they will, they'll decide to, to, to dig down deep into just a few things. They're also sometimes called the observer. So they, they need they feel like it's really about according to know everything about something before they act on it. And so they're observing the world, they actually prefer to like, have something in front of them when they're in the world so that they're not, they don't have to actually participate. In much rather observe I had a friend once who's a photographer, wedding photographers say, I love photographing weddings. I really don't like participating in them. I need something between me and what's happening to enjoy it. And so my camera is that thing. Yeah, fascinating. So they, they are also completely fives are all in their head. They're just so yeah, so much in their head. They want the world to be this enlightened place. And they also really love community and, and their personal space. And so when we twist all of that around, we get to the shadow side, it means that sometimes they can detached from life because they're so into whatever it is that they're they're learning about or researching. I say the internet is like the absolute worst invention. Think about like Wikipedia, or like all these little rabbit holes, you can go down. Yeah. And so so we need to just be careful guys need to be careful. With internet, the internet suck. And they can also they don't like being caught with their pants down. That's why they're the fear of like, not knowing something is so real for them that that's why they're they're doing all of this research. They don't like to feel stupid or unprepared. Yeah, yeah. So for a five, the virtue is detachment, meaning I can kind of detached from my head and actually enter into an A, and be active in the world around me and not so much. Yeah, and observer. So six, is the loyal person. And sixes are ours. Yeah, they're great. So sixes are really reliable, they're dedicated, and they're trustworthy. They want to make the world a more predictable place. So they're worst case scenario, thinkers, a lot of times, they always they, they're, they're cautious. And in a crisis, they really know what to do. So So six is no CPR, they know where the exits are, they have band aids in their pockets, or their purses, they are in the car. And they are like you in an ER, you want to six to help you because they, the way that sixes work is they have thought so much about all the different possibilities and a scenario there, there can be pretty fear based, that's why they're thinking of all these things, that when when the crisis comes, it's like, oh,

I know what to do. Okay, and let's just do it. And they don't think at that point. But they do a lot of thinking beforehand.

So they also, when when we turn it a little bit, they they win when they're in this field, they will either try to avoid it at all costs or conquer it. And and so, so that just looks a few different ways for some people. But yeah, in other words, they can, they can play devil's advocate really well. They can be really anxious, and they can look to authority to make decisions for them. So sixes have a really hard time making decisions for themselves. They really needed to, they asked this person their opinion, and this person of their opinion, and this person there. I had someone say once Yeah, but I've I've heard a lot of really great ideas. And I'm like, Yeah, but now you need to make your decision not right now. Yeah, totally. And, and that's, they can be super indecisive. And that's just, that's just part of it. Okay, and so the idea for six is when you start noticing that, okay, now you're going to turn yourself out of it. And the virtue is courage for success. So can you have the courage to make the decision or do the thing that you're struggling? Well, yeah. All right, type seven. So the joyful person, okay, and they are energetic, and really optimistic, and they like fun, and adventure and new things, and new ideas and new hobbies, and they just kind of ping pong all over the place. As far as like, you know, things that they liked, or hobbies, right. And so they've got lots of irons in the fire. They're super talent, multi talented, in fact, and they, they do this though, because they are wanting to not think about something else. So they're preoccupying their, their life in their brain, they're there in the headspace. So they, their brain is sometimes like monkey brain ish, or ping pong thing where you think about this thing you think about this thing, it kind of go back and, and the reason why is because there's always some underlying thing that they just don't want to think about. They're afraid that the, the great thing that's happening is going to end and that they're going to be stuck in this torment of horrible, sad emotions. And they don't like that. And so they're going to work really hard to not Yeah, do that. Yeah.

They can be kind of scattered scatterbrained too. So they can be the spice of life. See, the world is nothing but possibility. They can also be connected to their their emotions, and when we turn it and it's the shadow side, they're going to try to avoid the harder emotions and and just add more and more to their plate. My husband is a sick seven. And because we use any of them in our relationship, and in our marriage, I can see he's this he can do this for me too. But I can I just know like, I came home one night, and there was an immobile hanging from our, in our kitchen. And I was like you made immobile out of a broken fan. Yeah, I really want it I thought, you know, it'd be really fun. I just had the idea in my head. I'm like, Okay, cool. Well, great. I love the mobile. And I came back the next night, and I hit my head on something walking into our house. And I'm like, why did I ever had, it was another mobile in our house. And two, two of them. And I had the next morning. I was like, so love the mobile? Why do we have two mobiles on our house? And he then we had a conversation about, okay, this is what's really wrong. And this is what she was trying to avoid by making these videos, right. But it could be anything. It could be skydiving, it could be extra friend time, or just like going out every night. It could be work stuff, just anything that's going to avoid the hardest. The hard stuff of life. Yeah. So okay, so Eight. Eight is the powerful person. And they are strong, really strong. You, you can like feel when an eight walks into the room, they're energetic, and they're really confident. And they want to eliminate injustice in the world. And they really love to stand up for the underdog, they have got causes they want to fight for. And they don't like to be controlled. They also don't like to control. But if the control in the room is up for grabs, the eight will take it because of this need to not be controlled. Yeah. And they really, they don't like to be vulnerable in front of people. But that's like the the beautiful side of eight is that if you can get under the facade of this hard.

Exterior, they're like just the sweetest the sweetest people.

So at at at their best, their energetic and they have a lot of strength to do really good. A lot of good in the world. at their worst, they can be vengeful, domineering and super controlling. They might have a difficulty being compassionate because they aren't able to access that sweet side of them. So the virtues innocence can aids actually be vulnerable, and be okay with it, because it's really hard vulnerability is just harder to General. But for AIDS, it can just be super, super hard. So also, like stereotypically men who are aids are like, yeah, you know, people really gather doing great things. And women who are aids who are like, really strong women are not seen like that. And they're seen as a bad word. Yeah, and, and that's, that's just that sucks. Yeah, really bad. But that's how it is, I guess, at least stereo typically. And we have the chance to change that. All right, type nine, the peaceful person, or the peacemaker. So nines are optimistic, they're peaceful, supportive, they're really stable, they're really grounded. We want to make the world a harmonious place. And so we do that by using all of the energy that we have to keep peace inside of inside of us and out in the world. So a lot of times nines, they can see all sides of a situation. But they have a really hard time making a decision, a decision because they don't want to rock the boat. And so nines will say like, well, I don't know, where do you want to go for dinner. And really, we might have an opinion, or we might not, we actually might not. This is mind boggling for people, but nine sometimes just don't know. Or they need a little extra time to figure it out. And so, so that can leave to inaction, minimizing sometimes even kind of meshing or molding themselves into what other people think or believe just because either they don't know, or they don't want to have an opinion, because they're afraid that it could rock the boat. So they're the best of the best of the nine, they're going to be diplomatic and inclusive. And at the worst in the shadow side, they're going to lose their point of view and not take a stand on anything,

just because they want to keep the peace. And that's what, that's me.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 30:34

That's so cool. We're going to take a really quick break, and we'll be right back with Kristin.

Hey, today's collective members, I am so excited because

I am launching a brand new service. And it is Instagram at management and photography. So if you're struggling with keeping up with managing your Instagram account, maybe you don't really know how to take photos for your business. I'm so excited because I will be offering this new service where I will actually come in and manage your entire Instagram account from photography to posting to using the right hashtags and following the right accounts. This is something I feel like a lot of people in our community are looking for. And I'm really excited to be able to offer that now as a service within Twin Cities collective. In addition to that, I also am offering consulting. So if you're just needing a little bit of help, and you want that one on one, sit down with me to talk over your Instagram and come up with a plan, I do that as well. So if you want to head over to Twin Cities collective, you can see all the different services that I offer. In addition, I also do individual stock photography that is for your brand. So if you need an Etsy banner, or any type of photography, that includes products, I also do that as well. So just wanted to share a little bit more about some of the things that we are now offering at Twin Cities collective. So I hope you guys check it out on our website. Are you struggling with growing your Instagram, or getting your podcasts and launched, I'm really excited to announce that Twin Cities collective now has online courses. Now these aren't your regular courses that take weeks to finish. These are really short they are within two hours each. So I have three different courses available. I have Instagram growth, which is our very basic Instagram growing course we this is what I teach in person. We also have our ultimate guide to Instagram, which not only includes the Instagram growth course, but also talks about Instagram stories and Instagram TV, and how you can repurpose video for that. Finally, we have the Do It Yourself podcasting course. Now the nice thing about this course is it's all about the things that you need to know with podcasting, from working with clients to recording and editing to promoting your podcast, make sure to head to Twin Cities collective.com.

Click on the education button on the menu. And then you'll see the drop downs for the two different courses. And let's get back to the podcast.

Alright, we are back with Kristen. And so we went through all of the Instagram numbers. So now let's talk about how you can use these with your especially like with your business. Yeah, I feel like that would be an interesting topic. I don't know if you work with business owners, or it's mostly people like in relationships, or how do you kind of work with people? Sure.

Kristin Throckmorton 33:20

Yeah. I work with everyone. Okay. Yeah, here's so. So specifically with businesses and and team leads and folks that have that manage others. If you want a really good handle on how people make decisions, the anagram is going to be your go to it. It is it's deeply personal, right? Like it's super personal. But here's the thing, you in your own personal work and in your own life, you're you are going to take that to your job, right? The line there is super blurry, and it's super gray. And so when I work with companies, I work with teams and managers, I'm saying we need you need personal development here. Because personal development is going to cross into professional development and you want a whole person working on your team, who is going to know who they are so that then they can be a healthier, they can help the team to be healthier, they can be healthier on the team. And so when I work with when I work with teams, we focus a lot on how we make decisions. And, and the reality is we all make decisions differently. But but that can be lost on a team where we're working toward a specific goal. The thing I see most though is that people who so that enneagram, like the 10,000 view of enneagram is that there's the head, the heart and the body, each of those three have want each of those three triads have three numbers inside of them. So for quickly the body, it's eight, nine and one for the heart, which is like your feelings. It's two, three and four. And for the head, it's five, six, and seven. And so when you're making decisions on a team, somebody might be coming at it from the head, meaning they're like super analytical, they've done the numbers, they know the algorithms, they have the charts. And they might try, they might be trying to make a decision with somebody who lands in the heart, which means that they're making decisions based on feelings, which isn't bad, none of those are bad, or wrong or, or superior in any way. They actually they actually each have their place in, in work in business. But the thing is, is that sometimes had people and heart people can clash, I think of like it, and the sales team, like it is going to be full of analytical folks. Sales Team is going to be full of like go getters, right? Who are going to maybe a lot of threes honest Yeah. But they're gonna want to know, like, get an answer and just do it. And the IT team is gonna be like, well, we need like, there's a way you do this, right? Like, there's an analytical way. And the sales team is like, what? No, and then there's this clash? Yeah. If you can just understand how we make decisions, that can be a lot Do

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 36:18

you do it with like, entirely companies where everyone takes it? And then they all know each other's numbers? Or how does that work?

Kristin Throckmorton 36:24

Yeah. So I think in an ideal world, we would do away with the test. And that the it would be based on conversation and and presentation of the numbers, just because again, like testing, the test can be wrong. And there's multiple tests.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 36:42

And would you diagnose and not diagnose? But like, would you like, choose for somebody else? Or would you self

Kristin Throckmorton 36:48

diagnose? I would say, I would present all the numbers. So what I do is I present the numbers, and we do some little different thing. Yeah, exercises together. And, and then people can self diagnose pretty easily, okay. Sometimes I say, yeah, take the test, if you want to, I use a specific one. And, and you can see how it lines up. Some people want to take it before, it's kind of whatever you want to do. But then I always say if you do take the test, you gotta just do yourself, do the due diligence of actually thinking about it instead of just

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 37:24

right. Before. Yeah, before,

cuz I was listening to when you were talking about all them. And I was like, I feel like I'm kind of that one there somewhere. I'm like, I'm not that. Then there was somewhere I'm like, I feel like I have a lot of that. But then there was certain parts of it that I was like, Yeah, but that doesn't fit me. So like, there's parts of each one that I fit with. But then there's parts that I don't so like, I know what's like the most I got Yep.

Kristin Throckmorton 37:45

So I start with the head, heart and gut, you can decide for yourself where you land there. And if you make Decisions, decisions based out of your, your intellect in your brain, and you're in your head, we make decisions out of your gut, which would be where your body would, it should be like intuition. Sometimes you just know that you know that you know, or you make decisions out of your emotions or your heart. Those that's like, that's the one of the ways to knock out a ton of different numbers. The other thing again, because there's movement in the anagram, you, if you land at two, will you move to four and you move over to eight. And so you might have been living in this in your stress number, which would be the eight, you might have been living in that for so long that that's like second nature to you. It is to get back to who you you know, back to who you truly are sure, that means a little bit of self self knowing and asking some questions. And again, with all of this because it's so deep and intricate. We there's no shame in this right? Like no numbers better than another number. Everybody has their stuff everyone has work to do. And so there's no shame in it. So when I work with businesses, I have to say like, we you're you are giving a lot by sharing your number. Yeah. And, and that's good, because that's vulnerable. And if you feel safe on your team, and in your company that can be like super awesome. And for team leads, it's like, you know what, they everyone's coming at this from a different way. And you have the, the you have to be kind about this, and you can't use these numbers like just to write off someone. And but more so to give them individual help, or guidance or manage managing it. Yeah, you know,

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 39:43

that's so interesting. So how do now that we like if we figure out our number, how do we like become the best version of ourselves?

Kristin Throckmorton 39:52

Yeah. And I like the fruit. Okay, so the first thing is what I call snap. And it is, it's this is this ability to notice, so snap is stop, notice, ask questions and pivot. And so it is, it is doing some self noticing, and some, some, just in your own life, as you're going through your day, you're noticing you're doing something, you stop. And you ask some questions, or you stop and you notice what you're doing as and, and you then need to ask some questions. So for me, like when I'm and then you pivot, so for me when I am stressed, I am I go to six and I take I'm really unhealthy in that moment, I'm going to take on the the shadow sides of six, which means, which means I'm going to be asking everyone their opinion, I'm going to be wanting, I'm going to make a list, and I'm going to not be able to check anything off because I'm just spinning my wheels, and oh my gosh, I gotta get these things done. Right. And so um, and so if I can notice that I'm doing that interesting. And I can stop. Mm hmm. Okay, I'm just gonna stop, I'm going to notice Oh, my gosh, I have just been spinning my wheels on this list of like five things? Well, these five things aren't actually that big right? Stop notice, I'm going to ask questions. Why is it that I'm feeling this way? Why is it that I am really being unkind to myself or others right now? Why is it that I can't get this done? And once we can start asking those questions, we need to answer them actually. And then we can sn A p we can pivot just means pivoting into a new way of being a more healthy way of being, which, in this example, if I can just check off one thing on that list, right? Maybe it's like, I gotta call the doctor and make an appointment. Okay, I can pick up the phone and I can call the doctor will be five minutes. But for me, I just things blow up really big in my head. And I yeah, they just

snap and that is

for something called non judgmental observation. So your non judgmental Lee, observing yourself? Yeah, there's no shame in this game. We're not like that's not a thing. It's just noticing where we are so that we can pivot into a more healthy way. Once you start to notice that you will be amazed. By by we're sure by how you how you do things. Yeah. Because I think that the point of the anagram is to understand yourself better, right? Totally. Because if you can understand yourself, then you can start to understand other people. And if you can understand other people, then you can start to understand the broader world. And then you have good and good and good to give out.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 42:46

Yeah, that makes so much sense. So if there are people that are interested in learning more about the anagram what are some good resources, whether it's book podcast, you obviously a great resource, and you do these do you say you do workshops do or

Kristin Throckmorton 42:58

Yep. So I folks invite me into their, into their companies or into their teams, and I do half day full day three, our workshops. I do individual coaching, and consulting, I do couples coaching. Sometimes like small groups will want to learn about the unigram so I'll go into a small group and spend some time with them. And it is it's kind of an all a cart whatever you and your team are you need. I'm there to help you out.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 43:30

Are there other resources? Maybe that you'll read that recommend?

Kristin Throckmorton 43:33

Yep. So a really good first step is to read the road back to you by Ian Kron and Susan, Suzanne steel. That is a really easy read. It's really, it's funny, and it gives a lot of good. Any wisdom there. Then, I if you're like, I don't know. I still don't know. There's another book by her name is Beatrice, Beatrice chestnut. And it's the 20 it's called the 27 paths of the anagram I think something like that. Beatrice just not if you just Google her but she she goes into more detail on

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 44:19

a lot of other things

Kristin Throckmorton 44:20

of the anagram and podcast, there's one called topology. Okay. That and the host is Ian Tron. And there's another one called actually sleeping at last is

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 44:34

I was gonna bring that up. Yeah, they have like their they have this album with any room songs. Yeah. Oh

my gosh, I was like, literally gonna I heard about this. And I was like, so cool. I love them as I am right there. So good. So is it one album, or is it like they have an album for each? Nope, it's a song. Number. Yeah,

Kristin Throckmorton 44:51

yeah, you're right. And so so he has a song per number. I think he's on seven. He's releasing them as the Yes, I'm done. Then they have he has an image or a, like a painting or a picture for each. And they're just gorgeous.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 45:04

That's just gorgeous.

Kristin Throckmorton 45:06

Yeah. And, and also, then he also has a podcast. And so he explains how he how he crafted each of the songs. And when he's doing the songs. They he's trying to get into the head of that number. He's a nine. Okay, so we can do that easily. But yeah, but he's able to he tries to get into them how each number operates. And it that I've heard from many people that these songs can just be heart wrenching for them. Because it really gets down deep

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 45:35

into this into this stuff.

Kristin Throckmorton 45:38

Right? Number. Oh, it's just great. Song for seven is just I think my favorite so far. Yeah, and then he has a podcast to explain the workings of that. And then the last book I would recommend is it's called the sacred any agreements by Chris here It hurts. And he and right and from sleeping at last star friends and so on the podcast as well.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 46:03

Yeah. So that I don't know how I discovered that but I saw that those songs. I was like, That's so cool. Like such an interesting way to like, focus on each number as like a song like that.

Kristin Throckmorton 46:14

Yeah, so cool. Oh, and it's and he also, we talked about the head heart and the body. He has songs for each of those as well just called head, heart and body I do believe but even those it's like, Oh, I get it like the body he talks about like the fire in your bones. It's like yes, that's so it or magic in your bones. It's so cool.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 46:37

So how do we get in touch with you? Or what are the ways like your social media, your website?

What are all your handles? Okay?

Kristin Throckmorton 46:44

The website is her Tov h er t o v.org. Okay. And Instagram is her dot Tov, okay, that any a gram, okay? I also just released a gifts, my numbers guide. You can just get an amen a guy. And it is it's like it's not specific GIFs reach number but it's like how to buy thoughtful and meaningful gifts for each number. So you're not just buying a bunch of crap.

Jenna Redfield of Twin Cities Collective 47:13

Especially for Christmas. Yeah, that's a great that's a great giveaway thing that yeah, that's awesome. I'm really excited about it turned out pretty cool. Well, thank you so much for being here. This is so awesome. Yeah, I hope that everyone listening if you've never heard of enneagram, that you learn something today and that you will continue to learn about it because I I feel like I learned a lot just from Jason. Awesome. Well, thank you so much. I'll talk to you guys next week.

Thanks for listening to the Twin Cities collective podcast with Jenna Redfield. Make sure to click subscribe if you haven't already. And make sure to leave us a review on iTunes. Thanks again for Ian at Studio Americana for producing this episode as well as Melanie Lee for designing the podcast art and thanks to Nikolai had less for the use of the song intros outros. Thanks so much again, and I'll see you next time.